âKabul. In Afghanistan.'
âWhen were you born?'
âNineteen eighty-four.'
âTell me about your mother.'
âI do not remember much about her. She died when I was very young.'
âHow did she die?'
âAt that time, the Soviets were in Afghanistan. They had many men but few women. Sometimes they took Afghan women. Some soldiers came to my home. They took my mother, they took my sister. We never saw them again.'
âThey were taken as sex slaves?'
âYes. They were taken for sex. And later they were killed.'
âHow old were you then?'
âI was two years old.'
âYou were told what happened to your mother and your sister later, when you were older?'
âYes. By my father.'
âHow do you know they were killed?'
âThey did not come back. The Soviets left but my mother and my sister did not come back, and nor did many other women. They were all killed, I think.'
âSo you were raised by your father?'
âYes.'
âYou had two brothers. What happened to them?'
âMy older brother Ahmed was taken by the Mujahideen. They needed fighters and they took anyone they wanted. They took him. He was twelve years old. I never saw him again.'
âDo you think he is dead?'
âYes.'
âWhen did you last see him?'
âTen years ago.'
âWhat was he like?'
âHe was beautiful. People say he was like my mother. He was always laughing, always smiling, always protecting me. He was a very good boy.'
âYou miss him?'
âOf course. I miss him every day.'
âHe was born in the wrong place at the wrong time.'
âYes. He was too young to go fighting, and much too young to die.'
âTell us about your other brother. What was his name?'
âKhalid.'
He became involved with the Taliban?'
âYes. When the Soviets left the Mujahideen started fighting among themselves. Then the Taliban came to Kabul. They stopped the fighting, but they wanted to change people. All the men had to grow beards, this long. All women had to wear the burqa.'
âThe burqa is . . .'
âThe burqa is a kind of dress that covers the entire body, even the face and of course the hair. If we did not wear it properly, if it was too short or if it was damaged, the Taliban beat us. The Taliban beat many, many women in the street just for not wearing the burqa correctly.'
âWere you ever beaten?'
âNo, I never went out. My father did not want me to go out because he was afraid the Taliban would beat me.'
âBut Khalid went out?'
âYes. All boys had to go to the Taliban school. They taught the Qur'an, and only the Qur'an. Well, they also taught that America was evil. But that is all. Khalid went to the Taliban school, but he didn't like it. He was very angry with the Taliban. He went to join the Mujahideen, like Ahmed. So the Taliban were very angry with him. They captured some Mujahideen fighters, and one of them was Khalid. They brought him back to Kabul. They hanged him in the football stadium.'
âDid you see this?'
âNo, I did not see it but my friend, my neighbour, he told me. The Taliban were very angry with my father. They took him from the house and took him to the football stadium.'
âTo watch Khalid die?'
âYes. To watch him die. But he never spoke about it to me. He couldn't bear it.'
âBy now he had lost his wife, a daughter and two sons.'
âYes. There was only me left.'
âTell me about your father.'
âHe was a good man, a gentle man. He was a university professor, but when the civil war started he did not go to university anymore. When the Taliban arrived in Kabul, they searched our houses and took all his books except the Qur'an. My father had many books, thousands, probably. The Taliban took them all. They burnt all the books in the street. There were many bonfires in Kabul at that time. For a long time there was ash on the roof of our house from those fires. One day the rain washed it away. It was the end, I think, for my father. He didn't go out much after that. He spent his time teaching me. That was what he knew, what was important to him, to transfer knowledge. He taught me English, mathematics, history. Even without books he could teach. He was a good teacher, but he was too gentle for Afghanistan.'
âHow did you survive?'
âWe had many friends, many good neighbours who loved my father. They looked after us, shared food. My father had a garden. He grew vegetables, fruit. We had chickens. I looked after them. I liked the chickens; they were so funny. The Taliban did not like my father. They gave us trouble all the time. Mullah Abdul wanted to take me for a wife. My father kept telling him, no, she is too young. The mullah kept coming to see my father, he kept saying no. He said I was sick, that I had some nasty disease, that I was ugly. The mullah did not believe him. One day, the mullah arrived with three men, three talibs. They all had black beards, they all wore black turbans, they all wore shalwar kameez, the robe of the Taliban. They all had sticks and Mullah Abdul had a gun. He threatened my father. He said he was sick of waiting for my father to agree and he was just going to take me. My father again said no. The three Talibs hit him with their sticks.'
âWhere were you when this was happening?'
âI was in the house but I could see and hear everything. The Taliban had made us paint the windows because they said that women must stay out of view, but I could see through scratches in the paint.'
âWhat happened next?'
âMy father still argued. So Mullah Abdul shot him, here, in the stomach. My father fell down, and Mullah Abdul shot him three more times.'
âHe killed your father in cold blood.'
âYes. He murdered him. The other three men watched. One spat on his body.'
âThen Mullah Abdul came for you.'
âYes. I saw him turn towards the house. He was smiling, still holding the gun. Another unbeliever dead, I suppose. My father was lying in the dust. There was blood on the ground. But it was very quiet. Perhaps the sound of the gun had frightened people, like birds; they stopped making noise. Mullah Abdul came into the house, with the other three. Mullah Abdul grabbed me. I was not wearing the burqa, so he could see my face. He said that he knew now that my father had lied. He said I was beautiful and that I would make him very happy. He asked me if I was happy now, because I could be his wife. His teeth were very bad, his breath was very bad. He started to feel my body, all over. He told the men to search the rest of the house for books. Then he struggled with me. He told me that I must take off my clothes. I refused. He told me that he was a mullah and that I must obey. He was laughing. He started to pull off my clothes. He exposed himself. He hit me.'
âDid he rape you?'
âNo, because then my neighbour came in. He took care of the mullah and the other men.'
âTook care?'
âHe killed them. With a knife.'
âYour neighbour killed Mullah Abdul and three other men?'
âYes. He was very angry with the Taliban for killing my father and touching me.'
âWho was this neighbour?'
âI cannot say.'
âYou're afraid he might suffer?'
âYes.'
âBut the Taliban are no longer in power in Kabul.'
âIt does not matter. It is still very dangerous in Afghanistan.'
âSo you were in your house. Your father lay dead outside, and four men, including a mullah, were dead inside. What did you do?'
âMy neighbour told me I must escape. I had a friend who lived nearby. He knew my brother Ahmed. He was always looking after me. He helped me escape.'
âYour friend was Amir Ali Khan?'
âYes.'
âTell me about him.'
âHe has been very kind to me. He promised Ahmed that he would always look after me. He treats me like a sister. He protects me.'
âI would like you to look at this photograph. Do you recognise the man in the photo?'
âYes. That is Amir.'
âThe man who helped you escape the Taliban?'
âYes.'
âThe Australian government says he is a terrorist, a member of the al-Qaeda terrorist group.'
âYes, so they say.'
âIs he a terrorist?'
âNo, he is not a terrorist. He does not want to hurt people.'
âThe government says that he knows Osama bin Laden himself and trained in one of Osama's training camps.'
âYes, I think that is true. He told me that he had met Osama.'
âHe admitted meeting Osama bin Laden?'
âYes. But he told me he doesn't want to fight. Not Americans, not Australians. He doesn't want to fight anyone.'
âBut he
was
a fighter?'
âMost men in Afghanistan are fighters. He fought with Ahmed for the Mujahideen and for the United Islamic Front, you know, the Northern Alliance, against the Taliban. Al-Qaeda do not like him. He came to Kabul to protect me and my father from the Taliban.'
âWas it Amir Ali who killed the Taliban mullah and the three others?'
âNo. It was a neighbour. I told you that.'
âNot Amir Ali?'
âNo! Why do you keep asking?'
âDid you ever see Amir Ali commit a violent act?'
âAlmost every man in Afghanistan has committed violence at one time or another. Afghanistan is a violent country.'
âAmir Ali escaped from the Woomera Detention Centre at the same time that you did. He hasn't been seen since. Do you know where he is?'
âNo, I do not know. I wish I did.'
âThe government is worried that he is planning a terrorist attack.'
âThat is not true.'
âHe never talked to you about attacking Australian targets? Maybe hurting the politicians who were keeping you in detention?'
âNo. It is a stupid idea.'
âWhen did Amir meet Osama bin Laden?'
âI do not know! They are not friends. They are not enemies. They mean nothing to each other.'
âOkay, let's move on. Amir Ali helped you to escape from Afghanistan?'
âYes.'
âTell me about that.'
âWe had help from many people, many friends. They risked their lives for us. We left Kabul that day. I wore the burqa, Amir pretended he was my husband. A friend gave us a donkey, even though that donkey was his livelihood. I rode the donkey and Amir walked beside it. We walked for a long way. We walked all the way to Jalalabad. We were lucky that the Taliban were not organised. They didn't arrest us because they couldn't find us. Once we were stopped by some Taliban officials. They asked Amir if I was his wife and he said yes. They asked him why I was riding the donkey and he said because the donkey was old and he was too heavy for it. They just laughed and said they hoped he wasn't too heavy to ride his wife at night. Then they let us go.'
âThey never suspected you?'
âNo.'
âYou arrived in Jalalabad.'
âYes. When we got to Jalalabad more friends helped us. They told us how to get to Pakistan. We took a mountain pass on a very steep, very rocky, very dangerous path. We were told there were many bandits in the mountains but we were lucky and were not attacked. We arrived in Pakistan at a refugee camp. We stayed there for several months. Then Amir arranged for us to leave Pakistan.'
âHow did you leave Pakistan?'
âAmir had money. He made contact with some people smugglers.'
âWhere did Amir get the money?'
âI don't know.'
âThen he made contact with people smugglers?'
âYes. They got us passports and air tickets. We flew to Jakarta in Indonesia. When we arrived there we were met by other people smugglers. They took us in a bus somewhere, I do not know where. We stayed in a house with many other people, all waiting for a boat to take us away. Many people wanted to go to Australia.'
âWhy did you want to go to Australia?'
âMy father liked Australia. He often said he would like to live there. He said it was a good place, and that we would be treated with respect.'
âSo you told the people smugglers you wanted to go to Australia. What happened then?'
âAfter many days we were taken to a small town by the sea. We hid until night time and we were taken onboard a boat. It was a small, stinking boat with no toilet. They put dozens of us on board, many more than they should have.'
âHow many?'
âPerhaps sixty. Too many for such a small boat. We were almost falling off the deck. There were people from Afghanistan, Iran, Pakistan, Sudan, Iraq. Many from Iraq. We were all squeezed together, Sunni, Shi'a, Christian. It was very difficult, very unclean.'
âIt was a difficult voyage?'
âVery difficult.'
From its place in my hip pocket my phone rang. I pulled it out and diverted the call. Kat shot a sharp glance at me and leant back in her chair.
âOkay, let's take a break. Cut, fellas.'
I looked at the phone screen. The call was from Tarrant.
âMore coffee, please,' Kat said to me. âAnd turn your phone off, will you?' She looked back at Saira. âThat was great. We'll have a fifteen-minute break and then launch back into it, okay?'
âYes, that is fine.'
Kara, Lucy and Saira left the room and Ray and I cranked out more coffee.
âSaira's had a fun life,' I said.
Ray didn't reply. He was listening to the conversation between Kat and Susan, so I tuned in, too.
âShe's convincing,' Susan was saying. âGenuine. The viewers will warm to her. But that's hardly the point, is it?'
âLook, I don't see any harm in getting her story on tape.'
âI guess not, but we've got a fair bit to do if this is to go to air on Sunday.'
âOkay,' said Kat, âI'll move a bit quicker now.'