The Stranger's Child (58 page)

April 13, 1980 (Cecil’s 89th birthday!) /10.30pm.

I’m writing this up from skeleton notes while I can still remember it fairly well. On the coach back from Birmingham I started to play back the tape of the interview and found it goes completely dead after a couple of minutes: the battery in the mike must have given out. Amazing after twenty interviews that it should happen with this one – now I have no documentary proof for the most important material so far. Astounding revelations (if true!)

My appt was for 2.30. The Sawles have lived in the same house (17 Chilcot Ave, Solihull) since the 1930s: a large semi, red brick, with a black-and-white gable at the front. It was new when they bought it. George Sawle walked me round the garden before I left, and pointed out the ‘Tudor half-timbering’: he said everyone at the university thought it was screamingly funny that 2 historians lived in a mock-Tudor house. A pond in the back garden, full of tadpoles, which interested him greatly, and a rockery. He held my arm as we went round. He said there had been a ‘very ambitious rockery’ at ‘Two Acres’, where he and Hubert and Daphne had played games as children – he has always liked rockeries. Hubert was killed in the First World War. Their father died of diphtheria in 1903 ‘or thereabouts’ and Freda Sawle in ‘about 1938’ (‘I’m afraid I’m rather bad with dates’). GFS told me with some pride that he was 84, but earlier he’d said 76. (He is 85.)

Madeleine opened the door when I arrived – she complained at some length about her arthritis, which she seemed to blame largely on me. Walks with an elbow-crutch (shades of Mum). Said, ‘I don’t know if you’ll get much sense out of him.’ She was candid, but not friendly; not sure if she remembered me from Daphne’s 70th. Her deafness much worse than thirteen years ago, but she looks just the same. Her sense of humour is really no more than an irritable suspicion that someone else might find something funny. She said, ‘I’m only giving you an hour – even that may be too much’ – which was a completely new condition, and put me in a bit of a flap.

GFS was in his study – looked confused when I came in, but then brightened up when I said why I was there. ‘Ah, yes, poor old Cecil, dear old Cecil!’ A kind of slyness, as if to imply he really knew all along, but much more friendly than I remember at D’s 70th – in fact by the end rather too friendly (see below!) Now completely bald on top, the white beard long and straggly, looks a bit mad. Bright mixed-up clothes, red check shirt under green pullover, old pin-stripe suit-trousers hitched up so tight you don’t quite know where to look. I reminded him we’d met before, and he accepted the idea cheerfully, but later he said, ‘It’s a great shame we didn’t meet before.’ At first I was emb by his forgetfulness – why is it emb when people repeat themselves? Then I felt that as he didn’t know, and there was no one else there, it didn’t matter; it was a completely private drama. He sat in the chair beside his desk and I sat in a low armchair – I felt it must be like a tutorial. Books on 3 walls, the room lived-in but dreary.

I asked him straight away how he had met Cecil (which oddly he doesn’t say in the intro to the Letters). ‘At Cambridge. He got me elected to the Apostles. I’m not supposed to talk about that, of course’ (looking rather coy). What they called ‘suitable’ undergraduates were singled out and assessed, but the Society was so secret they didn’t know they were being vetted for it. ‘C was my “father”, as they called it. He took a shine to me, for some reason.’ I said he must have been suitable. ‘I must, mustn’t I?’ he said and gave me a funny look. Said, ‘I was extremely shy, and C was the opposite. You felt thrilled to be noticed by him.’ What was he like in those days? He was ‘a great figure in the college’, but he did too many things. Missed a First in the History tripos, because he was always off doing something else; he was easily bored, with activities and people. He sat for a fellowship twice but didn’t get it. He was always playing rugger or rowing or mountaineering. ‘Not in Cambs, presumably?’ GFS laughed. ‘He climbed in Scotland, and sometimes in the Dolomites. He was very strong, and had very large hands. The figure on his tomb is quite wrong, it shows him with almost a girl’s hands.’

C also loved acting – he was in a French play they did every year for several years. ‘But he was a very bad actor. He made all the characters he played just like himself. In Dom Juan by Molière (check) he played the servant, which was quite beyond him.’ Did C not understand other people? GFS said it was his upbringing, he (C) believed his family and home were very important, and in a ‘rather innocent’ way thought everyone else would be interested in them too. Was he a snob? ‘It wasn’t snobbery exactly, more an unthinking social confidence.’ What about his writing? GFS said he was self-confident about that too, wrote all those poems about Corley Court. I said he wrote love poems as well. ‘Yes, people thought he was a sort of upper-class Rupert Brooke. Upper class but second rate.’ I said I couldn’t work out from the Letters how well C knew Brooke – there are 2 or 3 sarcastic mentions, and nothing in Keynes’s edition of RB’s letters. ‘Oh, he knew him – he was in the Society too, of course. RB was 3 or 4 years older. They didn’t get on.’ He said C was jealous of RB in many ways, C was naturally competitive and he was overshadowed by him, as a poet and ‘a beauty’. Wasn’t C v good-looking? GFS said ‘he was very striking, with wicked dark eyes that he used to seduce people with. Rupert was a flawless beauty, but Cecil was much stronger and more masculine. He had an enormous cock.’ I checked that the tape was still going round nicely and wrote this down before I looked at GFS again – he was matter-of-fact but did look vaguely surprised at what he’d just heard himself say. I said I supposed he’d gone swimming with C. ‘Well, on occasion,’ he said, as if not seeing the point of the question. ‘C was always taking his clothes off, he was famous for it.’ Hard to know what to say next. I said were there real people behind all the love-poems? This was really my central question. He said, ‘Oh, yes.’ I said Margaret Ingham and D of course. ‘Miss Ingham was a blue stocking and a red herring’ (laughed). I felt I should come out with it. Did C seduce men as well as women? He looked at me as if there’d been a slight misunderstanding. ‘C would fuck anyone,’ he said.

At this point MS’s crutch whacked against the door and she came in with a couple of coffees on a tray. GFS has prostate trouble, but says coffee is good for his memory. ‘I’m starting to get a bit forgetful,’ he said. ‘A bit!’ said MS. GFS (quietly): ‘Well, you don’t always hear what I say, you know, dear.’ She said coffee excited him and made him confused about things; he continually got things wrong. She talked about him in the third person. GFS said, ‘Peter’s asking me about Cecil at Cambridge.’ She didn’t correct him, and nor did I (later I became Simon, and by the time I left I was Ian). ‘I remember C very well, though, dear.’ MS rather squashed me, perching on the arm of my chair; she said she’d never met C, but she took a dim view of the other Valances. Old Sir Edwin seemed nice enough, though he only talked nonsense by the time she knew him, and before that apparently he had only talked about cows; he’d always been a great bore. C’s mother was a tyrant and a bully. Dudley was unstable – he’d had a bad war and afterwards he used it as an excuse to attack friend and foe alike. I said, could he not be charming too? His first novel was very funny, and D’s book describes him as ‘magnetic’. ‘Perhaps to a certain type of woman. Daphne was always easily charmed. I was relieved when they split up, and we never had to go there again. Corley Court was a ghastly place.’ Having soured the atmosphere thoroughly, she went out again. GFS however seems not to take much notice of her – he makes the requisite signals and potters along in serene vagueness about the recent past, though events of 60 or more years ago are clear to him (‘clearer than ever’, he said, as if to say I was in luck). Still, he jumps around and is hard to follow. (He now spoke incoherently about WW1, when he was in military intelligence – nothing to do with C.)

I wanted to bring him back to what he’d been saying before we were interrupted. It took me a while to realize he’d lost what little sense he’d had of who I was – I reminded him tactfully. I said I’d recently met Dudley for the first time. ‘Oh, Dudley Valance, you mean?’ GFS then launched into a thing about Dud, how he’d been ‘stunningly attractive, but in a very dangerous way, very sexy’. Much more than C – he had marvellous legs and teeth. Dud was always naughty, satirical. C was his parents’ favourite, and Dud resented this, he was always making trouble. Later he became a frightful shit. I said in one of C’s letters he called Dud a womanizer. GFS said this was just a word they all used then for a heterosexual man, it didn’t mean anything. ‘Lytton and people always said it – they were all terrified of women.’ But C wasn’t, I said. ‘He was and he wasn’t, he didn’t understand women any more than he did servants.’ I said he (GFS) hadn’t made it clear about ‘womanizer’ in the Letters. Didn’t it create a misleading impression? He said Dud had read the book and didn’t object. He probably quite liked people to think he had been a Lothario. The thing about Dud in fact was that he wasn’t very keen on ‘all that’: he liked to play with women. After Wilf was born it more or less stopped – it was very hard for D. It was all part of his mental trouble after the War.

I asked had he been surprised when D suddenly married Dud? GFS: ‘It happened all the time. Women often married the brother of someone they were engaged to who was killed in the War. It was a form of remembrance in a way, it was a form of loyalty, and there was some kind of auto-suggestion to it. The young woman didn’t have to go searching for another man when there was a similar one already to hand.’ Were C and Dud particularly similar? ‘They lived in the same house, and D had a thing about Corley from the day she met C. C was D’s first love, but she was in awe of him. She was closer in age to Dud, and got on well with him from the start.’ I said how C had written to both D and Ingham from France saying ‘will you be my widow?’ but was he actually engaged to D? He said, ‘I don’t think so, though of course there was the child.’ What child was that? Here GFS looked genuinely confused for a minute, then he said, ‘Well, the girl, wasn’t it . . .’ He sipped at his coffee, still looking doubtful. ‘You see I’m not sure she knows about it.’ I said did he mean Corinna? He said yes. I said, well you know she died three years ago. It was an awful moment, his old face looked really helpless with worry, and then anger coming through, as if I was lying to him. I said she’d had lung cancer, and this did make some sort of sense to him. ‘Poor old Leslie,’ he said, but I didn’t feel I could say anything about Leslie’s suicide. He muttered about how awful it was, but I saw him coming to accept it, with a rather sulky look. He said, ‘Well, it doesn’t matter then.’ I still didn’t know what he meant. I said, ‘What about Corinna?’ Now I must get this right: he said that on C’s last leave, two weeks before he was killed, he had spent the night with D in London, and got her pregnant. (In her book D says they had supper in a restaurant and then she went home.) So did Dud think he was Corinna’s father? GFS didn’t know.

Of course I was incredibly excited by this, but at the same time I was worrying about the dates. Corinna was born in 1917, but when? I was furious that she was dead: the discovery of a living child would have been the making of the book! It gave me goose-bumps to think that that woman I’d seen several times a week until I left the bank might have been C’s daughter. Even her difficult and snobbish aspects, and her clear sense of having come down in the world, took on a more romantic and forgivable character. All that time, and I hadn’t known. And now she’s gone. Bad pangs of missed-chance syndrome, so that I’m telling myself, and even half-hoping, that it isn’t true. I said to GFS that Corinna and Wilf both look(ed) exactly like Dud. It seemed rude, and probably fairly pointless, to challenge him. I said, had D herself told him this? He said, ‘Well, you know . . .’

I decided I needed to go to the loo. MS was sitting in the hall by the telephone, as if ready to call for my taxi. Wondered if I could ask her what she knew, but some desire to protect GFS himself prevented me. Wondered about their marriage. I suppose she is anxious about him misbehaving in some way, she is grim but her worries come out; she said he is on heart drugs that react badly with his dementia, they can be very disinhibiting; alcohol is completely banned. I didn’t like to say that he seemed fairly disinhibited without alcohol. (What I don’t know, of course, is if he shares all these secrets – or speculations? – with her.)

When I got back I had to help him back again into what we were doing. I thought I’d ask him about Revel Ralph. (Not strictly relevant for the book, but I wanted to know.) ‘Oh, I loved RR, he was a charmer, very attractive, very sexy, though not in a conventional way. You know he married my sister. She ran away with him – it was a great scandal at the time, because Dud was always in the papers. He despised publicity, but he couldn’t do without it. Actually he didn’t seem to mind very much – he married a model, you know, a leggy blonde. She was a frightful bitch.’ I asked if D and RR were happy together. He said RR was much nicer than Dud, and younger of course – they didn’t have much money, but they became quite a famous couple too – they lived in Chelsea. ‘I used to say they lived on the mere luxuries of life. [This is the phrase D uses in her own book.] You know, Picassos on the wall, and the children with holes in their clothes. Wilf adored Revel, but Corinna disapproved of him. RR was a well-known stage designer. He was queer, and rather a weak character. D always fell for difficult men who couldn’t love her properly – they couldn’t give her what she wanted. RR became a drug addict, and they both drank like fishes.’ I asked if D had taken drugs. ‘I expect so. I wouldn’t be a bit surprised if she had tried it.’ Had he seen much of her in the 1930s? ‘We were never at all close. Well, she’s still alive, you know.’ Me: ‘But you don’t see her?’ I think he was genuinely unsure about this: ‘I don’t think we see much of each other now.’